HUDSON 112 assembled from CKD in UK in July 1938

JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
in HUDSON
I'm now the proud owner of this magnificient 82 year old vehicle, which is very rare in the UK, possibly unique, and which bears the UK number plate ESR430.

There are plenty of pics and lots of words in The Automobile magazine issue of April 2020, pages 40 to 45 about my car, before I bought it a week or so ago.

Does anyone else have a Hudson 112 from 1938 in the USA:  there don't seem to be any in the UK?
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Comments

  • PaulButlerPaulButler Posts: 900Administrator
    edited July 2020
    John , there are a few around in the club. I'll do you a list :)

    I'm also UK based and used to have a 1939 112. Have you joined or are you contemplating joining the club www.hetclub.org. We'd love to have you and your car.

    I'll search out The Automobile as well
  • Jon BJon B Posts: 7,192Administrator
    Welcome to the "Open Forum", John.  This is part of the Hudson-Essex-Terraplane Club and you may wish to join, as it's a great resource for finding parts, technical information and fellow owners of cars like yours.  There are club members all over the world, including the UK.  Paul Butler is our able internet specialist!  As you may already know, for many years Hudson had a plant just outside London where the CKD vehicles were assembled.
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    Would be interested to know what engine your car has.  Some British cars had an optional 16.9 h.p. engine, to  fall into a low tax bracket.
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    Sincere apologies to Paul, Jon, and Geoff:  I hadn't worked out where to post!  I'd love a list of 1938 Hudson 112s.  I'm not so sure now that mine was assembled from CKD, asI've read that froma few years earlier Hudsons were built from scratch in England.  My 112 has a 3.45l engine, bigger than the normal 2.9l.
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    All British Hudsons were built from imported components, mostly from Canada, but  all were made in  the Hudson  factory at Detroit.  The Canada facility was for tax advantages. 
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    This gets even more intriguing: doesthat mean I was correct originally in believing that my Hudson 112 - first register in England in 22 July 1938 - had been built in Detroit to special order - including RHD and 3.45l engine - then CKD, and then reassembled at the Hudson UK plant on the Great West Road in Brentford, Middlesex? 
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    Not built and then disassembled, but all the parts exported in a crate and assembled in U.K.  These export crates were shipped to Hudson's plant in Canada, and then exported to British Commonwealth countries, for better customs and tax rates.    Hudson England also  customised standard bodies and supplied many different custom bodies as well.  But they did not manufacture any of the parts there as far as I am aware. They did offer the option of the 16.9 or the 21.6 h.p. engine, the former being only for the British market.  If you had the smaller engine they came with the lower speed rear end.  You can read a lot of this information in Brooklands Books about Hudsons in U.K.    As in Australia, they probably used locally supplied wheels, tyres, upholstery, etc.   
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    Thanks again, Geoff.  Let me see if understood you correctly: All the parts (body, engine, gearbox etc) were manufactured in Hudson Detroit and exported to Hudson Canada, then exported to Hudson UK, and assembled here. 
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    That is correct.  Of course "Exported to Hudson Canada"   Was only a short trip across the border form Detroit. 
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    You might want to join the UK based Railton Owners Club as well.
    It has an excellent members' spare parts scheme.
  • HansHans Posts: 138Senior Contributor
    Just so you know, The plant in Detroit was "North" of Canada.

    So the parts may have been shipped "South" to Canada via the rail tunnel under the Ambassador bridge.

    Or shipped to the "East" over the Blue Water bridge and then to Tilbury Canada.

    Not many realize Canada does have a penisula that curves to the South and  then  West, putting part of Canada  "South" of Detroit

  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    Thanks again, guys: the more I discover the greater I feel I know EYR430. 

    There is a 1930 RHD Hudson Terraplane for sale on the Car and Classic website
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    It won't be a 1930 model, the Terraplane name did not come out until the 1932 Essex Terraplane first model in 1932
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    It's a 1937 Terraplane and it's a wreck.
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    Old Fogey UK said:
    It's a 1937 Terraplane and it's a wreck.
    Correction - it's a 1937 Hudson, but it's still a wreck.
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    Sorry the ad only says 1930s.  Is Essex a reference to the town of that name in Ontario?

  • Jon BJon B Posts: 7,192Administrator
    edited September 2020
    Essex was Hudson's lower-priced "companion" car, built from 1919 through 1932.  In 1932 Hudson came out with a new, smaller "companion" car, the Essex Terraplane, and they dropped the Essex as a stand-alone make.  The 1933 model was also called the Essex Terraplane, and in 1934 the low-priced car was simply called "Terraplane", the Essex nameplate now completely gone.
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    I saw the ad for this car and the 1930 date is obviously a misprint - quite a common occurrence on the website in question.
  • AnnaCarinAnnaCarin Posts: 46Member
    edited September 2020
    Is Essex a reference to the town of that name in Ontario?

    Apparently it was just meant to sound British, like Hudson. Back in 1916 they seem to have considered Kent as well (both Essex and Kent are counties in SW England). They filed a couple of patents as Essex Motors and a couple of others as Kent Motors in that year. But there was also another company called Kent, in Newark, New Jersey, that only produced about a dozen cars before it went bankrupt in 1917. Perhaps that made them feel Essex was a safer choice, to avoid mixups with a different, unsuccessful, company.

  • bob wardbob ward Posts: 1,230Senior Contributor
    Not to forget the equally British sounding Dover, the commercial version of the Essex.
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    Now I know the Essex label is nothing to do with the town of that name in Ontario, my next question is how or why was the Terraplane name dropped in favour of 112, which is just the wheelbase.  And, more importantly, how many 112s were built over what period?
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 4,100Senior Contributor
    I believe it was decided by management that the "Terraplane" moniker was becoming  a bit trite by 1937.   However the naming  of the 112 was an uninspired move by any means. 
  • PaulButlerPaulButler Posts: 900Administrator
    edited September 2020
    Now I know the Essex label is nothing to do with the town of that name in Ontario, my next question is how or why was the Terraplane name dropped in favour of 112, which is just the wheelbase.  And, more importantly, how many 112s were built over what period?

    John,

    Our very own Alex Burr (@hudsontech) answered this a while back:

    Unfortunately Hudson did not leave us with production numbers for years prior to 1946.

    Now, that said, I've been rooting around this stuff for over 30 years and it was only within the past few years I came across production figures from 1946 to 1954. So, somewhere in someone's collection earlier figures may be available - they just havn't turned up yet.

    Among the production numbers we've found are a 1948-1954 breakdown my model, ie, Super 6, Super 8, Hornet, etc, by year.

    However if you look here : http://hudsonterraplane.com/tech/other/1909-1957serialnumbers.pdf you will see a list of serial numbers.

    An extract from there shows you this:



    I can also tell you that as 2014 (I must get some later figures) that in the UK the number of 1939 Hudson's known were these:



    I actually got in touch with the DVLA and there is a department there that deals with all these odd-ball requests. Somewhere in my filing system I produced a list of "known" Hudsons from 1930 - 1957 based on serial numbers (VIN). 

    I'm tempted now to redo that work
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    I'm surprised there are that many, Paul.
    As regards 1934 and 1935 Hudsons and Terraplanes in Britain, I only know of around 15.
    What does your list say about those years ?
  • PaulButlerPaulButler Posts: 900Administrator
    Hello  David,

    As soon as I find where I've filed it I'll post them up. When I was working with the chap from the DVLA I specified some quite detailed search parameters but as he said (and I agree of course :)) you can't 100% guarantee that the figures are correct.

    It is quite possible that there is a reasonable error of margin for these but even so I was pleasantly surprised to see some high numbers.

    I will try and get back in touch with the DVLA in the next few weeks and see if I can get the exercise re-run.

    On the 112 side there have been a couple "surface" over the last couple of years that I'd never heard of, for example the one that was for sale a few months back done the road from me in Shropshire that had been somewhat butchered.

    The asking price of that was , to me, at least double what it was worth however it would seem that someone who wanted to rat-rod it picked it up. A shame to the purist in me however if it gets a Hudson back on the road for people to go "what's that" then I'm not going to complain.

    It always used to amaze me when I had a working Hudson i could play with how many people at shows used to stroll up and say "My father , grandfather , uncle used to have a Hudson years ago" and I KNOW there are still cars out there waiting to be found :)

    I just need to find the one that fits in my budget (somewhere south of naff all at the moment unfortunately!) that needs the TLC I can give it!

    One day I will have a car again ..... 
  • Old Fogey UKOld Fogey UK Posts: 562Expert Adviser
    My friend here on Isle of Wight wants to sell his '33 Terraplane 6 Windover Sports, Paul. Unfortunately he's suffering from "Overpriced-itis" at the moment...
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    All interesting stuff.  If there really are that many Hudson 112s in the UK, then I wonder why nobody contradicts my assertion that mine is unique. 

    Changing the subject, aAt a small show a few weeks ago, I was told that Monty had a Hudson one as a staff car in the war.  The old boy was adamant.  I didn't care to point out that Monty's staff car was in fact a Humber.

    On spoiling the appearance of my two tone grey 112, I wondered if anyone would mind if I had the wings painted darkish - not quite navy - blue to match the upholstery and carpets.  That would in my view, enhance the appearance and somehow sort of match what is often seen on eg Cadillacs of the same vintage.
  • JohnGooderhamJohnGooderham Posts: 22Member
    I've drawn a blank from DVLA in asking them how many Hudson 112s there are registered in the UK, with them saying the numbers are simply too small. So be it.
    I'm still wondering whether to have the wings/fenders repainted a mid blue, and I'd welcome advice.
  • PaulButlerPaulButler Posts: 900Administrator
    There you go John , as of 2014 when I last did it:

    Number of Hudson Cars licensed at the end of year, 2010 to 2014
    Model 2014 2013 2012 2011 2010
    Hudson 112 18 19 14 17 16
    Hudson Business Six 8 9 6 7 8
    Hudson Country Club Eight 18 16 16 14 12
    Hudson Country Club Six 9 8 8 7 6
    Hudson Custom Country Club Eight 6 5 3 5 6
    Hudson Pacemaker Six 17 17 12 15 14
    Hudson Six 25 26 25 26 25
    Total 101 100 84 91 87
    Number of Hudson Cars with a SORN declaration at the end of year, 2010 to 2014
    Model 2014 2013 2012 2011 2010
    Hudson 112 8 7 9 7 8
    Hudson Business Six 4 3 6 5 4
    Hudson Country Club Eight 4 4 3 3 4
    Hudson Country Club Six 0 1 1 2 1
    Hudson Custom Country Club Eight 2 2 2 3 2
    Hudson Pacemaker Six 2 2 6 5 5
    Hudson Six 6 5 5 5 6
    Total 26 24 32 30 30
  • tomruetomrue Posts: 39Member
    Type your comment? There are 25 1939 Hudson Six'es and I only know of 3. WOW

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