What is this frame? Value?

This frame was under a farm wagon that I bought for the body that I switched on to a regular wagon gear. I was going to scrap the frame, but then I got curious about it since it’s quite solid. I think I’ve narrowed it down to an Essex, but thought I would check with the experts here. Can anyone tell me what this is and if it has any value before I send it to the scrapyard?


  • wrenchtwisterwrenchtwister Posts: 5Member

  • cricketcricket Posts: 7Member
    My guess from looking at the front is 1931 Essex. Someone here certainly could use it.
  • Jon BJon B Posts: 6,975Administrator
    Thank you for taking the time to post this message and take the pictures, rather than scrapping it outright.  My guess is that it would be valuable to someone with a Hudson or Essex of that year.  (I just paid big bucks to have rusted areas on my frame restored, and would have loved to buy one in this shape!)

    Where is the frame located?
  • wrenchtwisterwrenchtwister Posts: 5Member

  • wrenchtwisterwrenchtwister Posts: 5Member
    Its located in Fenton, Mi. If anyone is interested in it, they can contact me through here. My email address is in my profile.  It belongs to the organization that I work for, a nonprofit food rescue serving the food insecure in metro Detroit. Whoever buys it, will also be supporting a charity at the same time. Now that I know that someone can use it, I’ll put it inside out of the elements today.
  • AnnaCarinAnnaCarin Posts: 33Member
    Have you checked how long the wheelbase is? That will help identify it.

    In July 1931, Hudson patented a frame design that is very similar to this (US1954078A), so my guess would be it's a 1932 or later model. The wide cross member above the rear axle is a vital part of the patent.

  • cricketcricket Posts: 7Member
    after seeing the hubcap its Hudson not Essex. Posting the frame # from rear passenger spring perch might narrow down the year.
  • Jon BJon B Posts: 6,975Administrator
    edited November 2019
    Here are photos of the '30-31 and '32-33 frames, from the parts manual, though I would assume that they would have been slightly different for the Hudson and Essex.  The 1930-31 frame photo on the left bears a definite similarity to the photos Wrenchtwister has posted.

    Cricket is correct: if you can find the serial number stamped in the frame or spring perch at the rear, that would nail the year and model Hudson / Essex.

    Wrenchtwister: If you have a bit of time to sell the frame,  I can give you instructions on how to list this, at no charge, in the White Triangle News (the printed bi-monthly magazine of the Hudson club).  The next deadline is Dec. 1, for ads that will appear in the issue that appears in mid-January.  The magazine reaches all 1500 (+ or -) members of the Club, which is probably a larger coverage than this forum (all Club members are not necessarily on the internet).  Just e-mail me at XXXdetailed@verizon.net (delete the XXX before mailing) and I'll give you that information.
  • 1954Hudson1954Hudson Posts: 145Member
    The hub cap looks like a 1932 Hudson,but the frame is not a 32
  • HansHans Posts: 64Senior Contributor
    32 Hudson had cable brakes, The front axle has the vertical pin for brake  pivot arm.
    Likely a 31 frame, size of brake drums, serial number of vehicle stamped on right rear spring iron, wheel base may help, but H & E both had 119".
  • AnnaCarinAnnaCarin Posts: 33Member
    Very helpful reference pics, I was obviously wrong! I've assumed that new concepts are patented before putting them into production, but now I realize it may just as well come as an afterthought. I'm grateful for that lesson.
  • Courtesy ManCourtesy Man Posts: 149Expert Adviser
    What about the spokes on the wheel hub - looks home welded - would that not have had wire wheels ?
  • Jon BJon B Posts: 6,975Administrator
    The original wheels were probably strengthened with steel spokes by the person who used the frame on a farm wagon.

    Incidentally, the parts manual infers that the photo of the 1930-31 frame applies to both Hudson and Essex.  However the part numbers for the 1930 and 1931 Hudsons and Essexe frames are all different, so in no year would the Hudson and Essex frames be identical.  Of course, the frames might have been virtually identical except for a bracket here, a clip there.
  • GeoffGeoff Posts: 3,683Senior Contributor
    It is a 1931 Hudson l.w.b. frame by the looks of it. 
  • wrenchtwisterwrenchtwister Posts: 5Member
    Thanks for all of your help, everyone. I’ll take some measurements and look for the serial number when I get back to it on Friday. As a dyed in the wool car guy, this is very exciting to have been able to salvage what might be an important piece. 
  • HansHans Posts: 64Senior Contributor
    I live in Adrian, could run up with book to look it over
    517- 2six 3-3 six  six 6
  • Jon BJon B Posts: 6,975Administrator
    Perhaps if someone has a Hudson or Essex circa 1931, they could tell Wrenchtwister precisely where to look for the stamped serial number which will confirm the make and year.  I believe that the rear passenger side spring perch (which Cricket suggests) would be at the extreme right rear corner of the frame.
  • HansHans Posts: 64Senior Contributor
    Serial Number  929009  Hudson T  wheel base 119  inches,  short chassis

    Rear axle ratio should be 4:3/11,  or 4:7/11.
    But rear axle ratio is 5:1/10 which is an Essex ratio, maybe  changed some time.

    Both brake drums indicate 12 inch brakes, which is Hudson.

    Wheel hubs are Hudson 5 bolt, all wire spokes cut out.

    Brake shoes may be inside drums,  front brake actuating levers  are  moveable.

    Front axle is severely  bent and twisted. Likely not repairable.

    Rear axle housing appears ok.

    Frame is twisted slightly starting in area of rear motor mounting bracket.

    Likely useable parts:  brake drums for wire wheels,  possible brake shoes etc, Wheel bolts to drum, Rear axle housing complete, Front and Rear "dumb irons" ( spring support castings), entire frame when straightened, rear differential.

  • Jon BJon B Posts: 6,975Administrator
    Hans, I'm assuming that you've posted the results of a personal inspection of the car....correct?
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